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Offline Someone12116

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Re: improve pking
« Reply #30 on: January 22, 2017, 06:05:07 pm »
No. This isn't the problem with pking. The problem with pking is that nobody wants to get into it because the pking community is genuinely unfriendly towards nowcomers.
well charr you can't change their behavior

That's only true if the numeral value of your age in years is between 10 and 15.

Offline Saif Nawaf

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Re: improve pking
« Reply #31 on: January 22, 2017, 07:15:58 pm »
Newcomers won't get into pking if they get flamed at for being inexperienced or not wanting to fight someone.
well, then I have a simple solution for that. to reduce the amount of flame at PVP all that emps have to do is: give a player the ability to mute flamers at edj-pvp ONLY.
and I hope they pick the right person such as "bhaa 2" or "attacker21" and avoid flamers themselves without missioning anyone. the problem with these great pkers is that they quit and they play once or twice a month. need to mention putting a staff in pvp won't be helpful.
so three things if you will take this seriously:-
1) a player spend 75% of playing emps in pvp
2) a player who has respect to others and doesn't rage
3) avoid stakers
« Last Edit: January 22, 2017, 07:20:38 pm by Saif Nawaf »
"The strongest among you is the one who controls his anger."

Offline Cjkinsey6

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Re: improve pking
« Reply #32 on: January 22, 2017, 07:40:27 pm »
Newcomers won't get into pking if they get flamed at for being inexperienced or not wanting to fight someone.
well, then I have a simple solution for that. to reduce the amount of flame at PVP all that emps have to do is: give a player the ability to mute flamers at edj-pvp ONLY.
and I hope they pick the right person such as "bhaa 2" or "attacker21" and avoid flamers themselves without missioning anyone. the problem with these great pkers is that they quit and they play once or twice a month. need to mention putting a staff in pvp won't be helpful.
so three things if you will take this seriously:-
1) a player spend 75% of playing emps in pvp
2) a player who has respect to others and doesn't rage
3) avoid stakers

While I would like to think we could trust a number of players with this power, ultimately it's not a great idea. All it takes is for one person to lose their temper and begin to abuse for it all to go wrong. Dealing with rule breakers is the job of the staff-team.
People PKing in Edgeville and staking in the duel arena seem to resort to flaming in retaliation rather than calling for a staff member or posting a report on the helpdesk - which in turn just results in a number of people flaming eachother constantly.
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Offline Saif Nawaf

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Re: improve pking
« Reply #33 on: January 22, 2017, 08:28:23 pm »
While I would like to think we could trust a number of players with this power, ultimately it's not a great idea. All it takes is for one person to lose their temper and begin to abuse for it all to go wrong. Dealing with rule breakers is the job of the staff-team.
People PKing in Edgeville and staking in the duel arena seem to resort to flaming in retaliation rather than calling for a staff member or posting a report on the helpdesk - which in turn just results in a number of people flaming eachother constantly.
but flaming is a part of staking
and players stake while most players recommend them to not.
lets go back to pking shale we :)
"The strongest among you is the one who controls his anger."

Offline Cjkinsey6

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Re: improve pking
« Reply #34 on: January 22, 2017, 08:39:53 pm »
While I would like to think we could trust a number of players with this power, ultimately it's not a great idea. All it takes is for one person to lose their temper and begin to abuse for it all to go wrong. Dealing with rule breakers is the job of the staff-team.
People PKing in Edgeville and staking in the duel arena seem to resort to flaming in retaliation rather than calling for a staff member or posting a report on the helpdesk - which in turn just results in a number of people flaming eachother constantly.
but flaming is a part of staking
and players stake while most players recommend them to not.
lets go back to pking shale we :)

Flaming is a part of staking? Seriously? lol
Flaming is not a necessity while staking ._.
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Offline Drugs

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Re: improve pking
« Reply #35 on: January 22, 2017, 08:59:09 pm »
While I would like to think we could trust a number of players with this power, ultimately it's not a great idea. All it takes is for one person to lose their temper and begin to abuse for it all to go wrong. Dealing with rule breakers is the job of the staff-team.
People PKing in Edgeville and staking in the duel arena seem to resort to flaming in retaliation rather than calling for a staff member or posting a report on the helpdesk - which in turn just results in a number of people flaming eachother constantly.
but flaming is a part of staking
and players stake while most players recommend them to not.
lets go back to pking shale we :)

Flaming is a part of staking? Seriously? lol
Flaming is not a necessity while staking ._.
Uhmm I beg to differ, some insults give you more defence while staking


A7eeee
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Offline Saif Nawaf

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Re: improve pking
« Reply #36 on: January 23, 2017, 07:35:08 am »
Newcomers won't get into pking if they get flamed at for being inexperienced or not wanting to fight someone.
well, then I have a simple solution for that. to reduce the amount of flame at PVP all that emps have to do is: give a player the ability to mute flamers at edj-pvp ONLY.
and I hope they pick the right person such as "bhaa 2" or "attacker21" and avoid flamers themselves without missioning anyone. the problem with these great pkers is that they quit and they play once or twice a month. need to mention putting a staff in pvp won't be helpful.
so three things if you will take this seriously:-
1) a player spend 75% of playing emps in pvp
2) a player who has respect to others and doesn't rage
3) avoid stakers

While I would like to think we could trust a number of players with this power, ultimately it's not a great idea. All it takes is for one person to lose their temper and begin to abuse for it all to go wrong. Dealing with rule breakers is the job of the staff-team.
People PKing in Edgeville and staking in the duel arena seem to resort to flaming in retaliation rather than calling for a staff member or posting a report on the helpdesk - which in turn just results in a number of people flaming eachother constantly.
add someone from the staff responsible on edje and one responsible for duel.although I don't think you will do that thats why I said give a player the ability to mute flamers for 1h MAX
his duty is to just mute flamers for a short period of time to keep control of his given area.
« Last Edit: January 23, 2017, 07:37:14 am by Saif Nawaf »
"The strongest among you is the one who controls his anger."

Offline Charr

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Re: improve pking
« Reply #37 on: January 23, 2017, 10:20:34 am »
add someone from the staff responsible on edje and one responsible for duel.although I don't think you will do that thats why I said give a player the ability to mute flamers for 1h MAX
his duty is to just mute flamers for a short period of time to keep control of his given area.
It already is the staff's duty to deal with rulebreakers. However the staff team should still be allowed to play the game itself if they want to. This is why you as a player have the ability to report rulebreakers to the staff team. Players do not need the ability to mute, players already have the ability to report people, which results in a mute. People just need to stop being lazy and actually report people on the helpdesk.
;

Offline Ameer

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Re: improve pking
« Reply #38 on: January 23, 2017, 10:45:29 am »
Players have a great special ability that is at least 100 times better than muting other, its called a fucking ignore list
if you don't like him, add him to ignore list it simple as that and when you feel like he changed, remove him from there ( or simply keep him there forever nothing wrong with that )



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Offline Saif Nawaf

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Re: improve pking
« Reply #39 on: January 23, 2017, 11:04:45 am »
Players have a great special ability that is at least 100 times better than muting other, its called a fucking ignore list
if you don't like him, add him to ignore list it simple as that and when you feel like he changed, remove him from there ( or simply keep him there forever nothing wrong with that )
exactly thank you so much!
"The strongest among you is the one who controls his anger."

Offline Attacker35

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Re: improve pking
« Reply #40 on: January 25, 2017, 05:56:02 pm »
how would you make it easier for people to take their gear? its really just how you wanna place them into your bank yourself.

make a default slot the you setup and it takes out your default pk gear for example dh set with wapons, pots, food, and runes
so u click the command button and it automatically takes them out for you from the bank.
are you seriously such a lazy person that you need a goddamn button to take out 10 different items? i've lost faith in this part of the community..
Faith being lost because of a possible feature that feature that saves you a tad bit of time, why?
This would be an amazing feature to go with the hopefully upcoming placeholder feature, i tend to switch gears respectively to who I fight, which means a lot of regearing. Wouldn't hurt by any means to have it implemented.

I thought of bringing out some points that could possibly make pking enjoyable, viable, definitely forgiving for newer pkers, to also make them last in the wilderness without them running back to the arena after their first death.

1) Varied weaponry - Imo one of the biggest things that the 1v1 fights lack of, people using daggers, zamorakian spears, agses and granite mauls nonstop at pretty much all times. Surely, you'll see a couple of gladiator mauls and claws/Oclaws though very rarely. Range fights are just dart/crossbow spam into javelins/axes. Might seem like an OK variety to some people, though seems poor for me. Here's a post i made about a couple of weapons that i'd like to see adjusted, that. By no means would that be enough, i'd still like to see more different things, combos used that are actually viable compared to the current ''Meta''.

https://emps-world.net/forum/index.php?topic=18667.0

2) Current state of defense and accuracy bonuses. I don't just think that it's unecessary, but along with it there's a lot of flaws. It confuses alot of new pkers, even pkers that don't know all that much about how bonuses and stuff work, what actually matters in a gear setup.
Currently, all main armours offer you positive defense bonuses against all 3 combat styles, which is just not right. A mage with 3A robes will easily outdamage almost anybody. Saying that mage/range armours are too tanky is not the right way to put it. 3A mage robes legit have almost the highest melee defense in the game, with the recent +10% defense buff, i really don't know what has been thought when it's been implemented. I see this as an overall unhealthy system. Right now, it's a straight forward ''spamfest'' gear setup-wise. People use whatever they want, there's no flaw on fighting a wizard with plate armours. This being partially a reason why bridding is also dead, Tank gear/hides are absolutely useless in brid fights (in the meaning of swapping melee gear on, against your opponents whip/spec wep), they are over with about 4-6 freezes with either of the players barely having a chance to spec. (yes, i'm also saying that freeze times are way too long).
Accuracy bonuses, that are offered from armors is another thing that is just unecessary, not sure why they got featured. Basically, melee armors offer you melee accuracy, robes offer magic accuracy, range armors range accuracy. (another reason why hides are useless in brid fights, using plate armors when meleeing is just way more worth it, specially if you barely have a chance to spec your opponent.)  This is probably what also confuses alot of players, specially when people spec with an ags in robes or use a bow in partially melee-range gear.
The whole system would be a complete mess to fix, though imo it would be 100% worth it. Needless to be said, a lot of things need tobe changed along with it - example, balancing weapon accuracy. I'm not sure, though couldn't it just be reverted into what it has been, then adding small adjustments like strength bonuses on barrow armors and so on, because this is how it was in the old emps days, this is how it currently is in OsRs. As stated, just seems like a healthier system, even though it might seem like a lot of work to go trough. I have not considered things about pvm, though it does not seem that alot needs to be changed, other than maybe nerfing certain magic attacks on bosses. With this, range armors would be viable in melee setups for pvming, which (in my mind) would bring a lot of color to the pvm scene and make it more varied. That's another thing to talk of though and i'm not very similar to the current state of pvm.
EDIT: Forgot to mention. The fix to the armours being all around ''op'' would be adding negative/at least neutral bonuses. I know that Thomy has said that he's not a fan of them, though i can't stand the current system - negative/neutral bonuses seem crucial.

Sorry, i went really off topic with this point, though it's something that i've wanted to write about for a long time, I just haven't bothered to.

3) Bugfixes & testing weaponry/armors before they go live - Report all bugs found in the pvp. Straight forward, yet there's many. Soon, i'll make a topic about the ones that I know of.
I'm not sure whether it just seems to be so but legit, test everything before they go live. Which would go for both pvm and pvp. 2 Buffs for dark bow, yet it's still useless. A nerf for Vspear, it's now close to being useless. Obsidian claws just inaccurate as all hell. OR give us a method to test them in W3 - didn't people find bugs for GE when it was possible to test it in W3? Which would also go for testing weaponry, making sure that it's not over/underpowered.

4) PKP shop? Very unsure of how something like this would function, a way to make farming points impossible needs to be covered. Haven't thought about this much, just a great overall idea. Along with it, titles in front of your name/logos above your head when in the wilderness/colored skulls dependant on killstreaks? Wouldn't say those are hard to implement, though of course they'd not be all that there is to the PKP store.

EDIT: 5) There's 2 last updates that have rustled me to hell. Healing splats and healthbar values. your opponents health value is just something that imo you shouldn't have knowledge of, not only will it make prodding even more ''Popular'' but it will just make fights even more RNG based than they currently are. Both of those features also kill one of my favourite mechanics, fake eating (drinking a potion and equipping a spec weapon during the animation - this is not as straight forward as it sounds because of other animations possibly cancelling your drinking animation, making you fail the mechanic.) Of course, 1 tick specs can be done, though they're very odd in emps-world because of the game tick being rather short.
Brings me to yet another point, maybe poll features like this? Surely they seem like a harmless thing, though i disgust both of the features PvP-wise.
I'll bring an example, a dharok fight scenario to explain why I do not like the heal splats. Say you get hit rather low health, 20-40 ish and you're looking to axe your opponent back, without eating. Because often at times, you wouldn't actually see your opponent eating when he gets hit (because the ''blocking'' animation cancels out eating animations quite often) you would be able to go for an axe hit. Heal splats just give the opponent an easy way to react, just by seeing you sitting on low health, not eating, probably making the opponent cast vengeance/spec you out.

There's so much more ideas that I could add in here to improve pking in many ways, though i'll leave it at that right now, I want to see what people think.
Big thanks to everyone who cares about the current state of the wilderness and PvP.
Maybe with proper changes we can make it so that there's at last more people in the wilderness than there is in the duel arena.
« Last Edit: January 25, 2017, 06:08:57 pm by Attacker35 »

Offline Triangle Dot

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Re: improve pking
« Reply #41 on: January 25, 2017, 07:50:51 pm »
Not sure why Pat attacked only me in wildy several moments ago, when all people got kolodion near Zamorak mage in multi killed it, and then nobody rushes anybody but somehow turns out, that Pat kills me for no reason yet again. Neither I was with risk neither do I care with Pvp points,as if they matter they don't do much anyways.

This is just example, on both newcomer and old player side. You get in Wilderness, not sure why you get killed(as if losing your last supplies get you somewhere) and then people embarrass you even more by flaming you to friends: "hhhhh look it's Triangle Dot, he doesn't risk anything, I KOed him clean.. hhhhhhhh, he came back all mad hhhhh" How low you get when you kill the newcomers then? Nobody learnt to pk in one day, so get a grip. Fight someone you're own size. If community has a problem with me, surely I can easily want to get muted, banned or whatever means necessary just to let others enjoy server till it becomes one player opened with two clients fighting with himself in wildy. Not even revenants or wildy wirm will get you wildy then... Right now, I wanna know this. Why exactly my actions and words are flamed all over forums, emps pvm and pk community?

Offline Attacker35

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Re: improve pking
« Reply #42 on: January 25, 2017, 10:52:13 pm »
Not sure why Pat attacked only me in wildy several moments ago, when all people got kolodion near Zamorak mage in multi killed it, and then nobody rushes anybody but somehow turns out, that Pat kills me for no reason yet again. Neither I was with risk neither do I care with Pvp points,as if they matter they don't do much anyways.

This is just example, on both newcomer and old player side. You get in Wilderness, not sure why you get killed(as if losing your last supplies get you somewhere) and then people embarrass you even more by flaming you to friends: "hhhhh look it's Triangle Dot, he doesn't risk anything, I KOed him clean.. hhhhhhhh, he came back all mad hhhhh" How low you get when you kill the newcomers then? Nobody learnt to pk in one day, so get a grip. Fight someone you're own size. If community has a problem with me, surely I can easily want to get muted, banned or whatever means necessary just to let others enjoy server till it becomes one player opened with two clients fighting with himself in wildy. Not even revenants or wildy wirm will get you wildy then... Right now, I wanna know this. Why exactly my actions and words are flamed all over forums, emps pvm and pk community?
I began seriously pking in the beginning of world, i got killed like no tomorrow aswell, though i began to work it out over time.
You legit replied here because i killed you for possible loots? You had just defeated kolodion and looted your drop. Why did i kill you when you had no armor and i saw the opportunity to spec? What a question
After all, people kill nonitemers alot, i can't be sure for what reason, let it be pkp or just the lack of people, it's the wilderness. I can't say i never kill nonitemers (without me knowing whether they have something or not) because i do, in deeper wilderness. How come i know whether you're running back to their death location? or holding 800m gps in your inventory? Or you've just completed a clue? - I assume you've got my point.

Also, people are always blaming the experianced ones, pkers that are used to the wilderness, when people like you walk under my fight, try to ruin my fight about three times just because i killed you after you looting kolodion?
I had this encounter a day ago, a rather rich staker came to risk fight me and kept eating to 85+, up to 100. Was annoying, stated it many times until he began to just shittalk me for being a safer, when i tried my best not to, even when he was at a safe advantage  often at times. Even though he himself said that he's  new to pking, when i told him not to trash me over things that he doesnt know of, i just get a "idc stfu" as a response. It's not the pker, it's the newcomer often at times who gets the pker's jet burning.

Could we please stick to the topic, though?
« Last Edit: January 25, 2017, 10:54:23 pm by Attacker35 »

Offline Saif Nawaf

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Re: improve pking
« Reply #43 on: January 26, 2017, 09:24:57 am »
Faith being lost because of a possible feature that feature that saves you a tad bit of time, why?
This would be an amazing feature to go with the hopefully upcoming placeholder feature, i tend to switch gears respectively to who I fight, which means a lot of regearing. Wouldn't hurt by any means to have it implemented.

I thought of bringing out some points that could possibly make pking enjoyable, viable, definitely forgiving for newer pkers, to also make them last in the wilderness without them running back to the arena after their first death.

1) Varied weaponry - Imo one of the biggest things that the 1v1 fights lack of, people using daggers, zamorakian spears, agses and granite mauls nonstop at pretty much all times. Surely, you'll see a couple of gladiator mauls and claws/Oclaws though very rarely. Range fights are just dart/crossbow spam into javelins/axes. Might seem like an OK variety to some people, though seems poor for me. Here's a post i made about a couple of weapons that i'd like to see adjusted, that. By no means would that be enough, i'd still like to see more different things, combos used that are actually viable compared to the current ''Meta''.

https://emps-world.net/forum/index.php?topic=18667.0

2) Current state of defense and accuracy bonuses. I don't just think that it's unecessary, but along with it there's a lot of flaws. It confuses alot of new pkers, even pkers that don't know all that much about how bonuses and stuff work, what actually matters in a gear setup.
Currently, all main armours offer you positive defense bonuses against all 3 combat styles, which is just not right. A mage with 3A robes will easily outdamage almost anybody. Saying that mage/range armours are too tanky is not the right way to put it. 3A mage robes legit have almost the highest melee defense in the game, with the recent +10% defense buff, i really don't know what has been thought when it's been implemented. I see this as an overall unhealthy system. Right now, it's a straight forward ''spamfest'' gear setup-wise. People use whatever they want, there's no flaw on fighting a wizard with plate armours. This being partially a reason why bridding is also dead, Tank gear/hides are absolutely useless in brid fights (in the meaning of swapping melee gear on, against your opponents whip/spec wep), they are over with about 4-6 freezes with either of the players barely having a chance to spec. (yes, i'm also saying that freeze times are way too long).
Accuracy bonuses, that are offered from armors is another thing that is just unecessary, not sure why they got featured. Basically, melee armors offer you melee accuracy, robes offer magic accuracy, range armors range accuracy. (another reason why hides are useless in brid fights, using plate armors when meleeing is just way more worth it, specially if you barely have a chance to spec your opponent.)  This is probably what also confuses alot of players, specially when people spec with an ags in robes or use a bow in partially melee-range gear.
The whole system would be a complete mess to fix, though imo it would be 100% worth it. Needless to be said, a lot of things need tobe changed along with it - example, balancing weapon accuracy. I'm not sure, though couldn't it just be reverted into what it has been, then adding small adjustments like strength bonuses on barrow armors and so on, because this is how it was in the old emps days, this is how it currently is in OsRs. As stated, just seems like a healthier system, even though it might seem like a lot of work to go trough. I have not considered things about pvm, though it does not seem that alot needs to be changed, other than maybe nerfing certain magic attacks on bosses. With this, range armors would be viable in melee setups for pvming, which (in my mind) would bring a lot of color to the pvm scene and make it more varied. That's another thing to talk of though and i'm not very similar to the current state of pvm.
EDIT: Forgot to mention. The fix to the armours being all around ''op'' would be adding negative/at least neutral bonuses. I know that Thomy has said that he's not a fan of them, though i can't stand the current system - negative/neutral bonuses seem crucial.

Sorry, i went really off topic with this point, though it's something that i've wanted to write about for a long time, I just haven't bothered to.

3) Bugfixes & testing weaponry/armors before they go live - Report all bugs found in the pvp. Straight forward, yet there's many. Soon, i'll make a topic about the ones that I know of.
I'm not sure whether it just seems to be so but legit, test everything before they go live. Which would go for both pvm and pvp. 2 Buffs for dark bow, yet it's still useless. A nerf for Vspear, it's now close to being useless. Obsidian claws just inaccurate as all hell. OR give us a method to test them in W3 - didn't people find bugs for GE when it was possible to test it in W3? Which would also go for testing weaponry, making sure that it's not over/underpowered.

4) PKP shop? Very unsure of how something like this would function, a way to make farming points impossible needs to be covered. Haven't thought about this much, just a great overall idea. Along with it, titles in front of your name/logos above your head when in the wilderness/colored skulls dependant on killstreaks? Wouldn't say those are hard to implement, though of course they'd not be all that there is to the PKP store.

EDIT: 5) There's 2 last updates that have rustled me to hell. Healing splats and healthbar values. your opponents health value is just something that imo you shouldn't have knowledge of, not only will it make prodding even more ''Popular'' but it will just make fights even more RNG based than they currently are. Both of those features also kill one of my favourite mechanics, fake eating (drinking a potion and equipping a spec weapon during the animation - this is not as straight forward as it sounds because of other animations possibly cancelling your drinking animation, making you fail the mechanic.) Of course, 1 tick specs can be done, though they're very odd in emps-world because of the game tick being rather short.
Brings me to yet another point, maybe poll features like this? Surely they seem like a harmless thing, though i disgust both of the features PvP-wise.
I'll bring an example, a dharok fight scenario to explain why I do not like the heal splats. Say you get hit rather low health, 20-40 ish and you're looking to axe your opponent back, without eating. Because often at times, you wouldn't actually see your opponent eating when he gets hit (because the ''blocking'' animation cancels out eating animations quite often) you would be able to go for an axe hit. Heal splats just give the opponent an easy way to react, just by seeing you sitting on low health, not eating, probably making the opponent cast vengeance/spec you out.

There's so much more ideas that I could add in here to improve pking in many ways, though i'll leave it at that right now, I want to see what people think.
Big thanks to everyone who cares about the current state of the wilderness and PvP.
Maybe with proper changes we can make it so that there's at last more people in the wilderness than there is in the duel arena.
you forgot to mention rushers, they give a hard time to new comers as well. A new pkers need to learn how to eat and what to expect and if he goes in wildy with no prayer on and not potted he will most probably die to a dude who rushes ice/ags or Oclaws/ags. If that person lost something variable to him eg. Zs or his GS so won't ever thing of going to pvp ever again.
"The strongest among you is the one who controls his anger."

Offline Charr

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Re: improve pking
« Reply #44 on: January 26, 2017, 09:40:35 am »
you forgot to mention rushers, they give a hard time to new comers as well. A new pkers need to learn how to eat and what to expect and if he goes in wildy with no prayer on and not potted he will most probably die to a dude who rushes ice/ags or Oclaws/ags. If that person lost something variable to him eg. Zs or his GS so won't ever thing of going to pvp ever again.
I think everyone knows how to click on their manta rays/brews. Rushing isn't a big problem at all.
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