He's on a roll, boys!

Quote from: Someone12116 on September 23, 2015, 09:26:53 pm

The thing is, those only work temporarily. Use existing items to get even more powerful items -> everything will get even more easier AND items become ultimately even cheaper.

When was the last time you took a look at RS?

I don't think I said anything about the way those items would be sinked, did I?

Whatever item sinks you're wanting to add, this is what I am trying to tell you.

Zamorakian Spears became upgradeable to Chaotic Spears on 27 May 2014, creating an item sink to them.



You can see the price going up at first, but after 2 months, comes the first crash. Then it goes up a bit again, and crashes for real. Now the price is around 600k, because Corp is totally pointless to do. Why?

https://i.gyazo.com/ef377ce3bbc26ef9562cdab48c95bd38.png
https://i.gyazo.com/a7889811434d9acc3d891e9768aca8a8.png
https://i.gyazo.com/8286fea1dc6a3203cfe8124aa822eb19.png

Spirit shield crashed to oblivion.

@Charr, you've been incessantly preaching about adding item sinks for months, but I have yet to see you make a valid and thorough suggestion as to HOW items should be removed.  It's useless to say we need something but do nothing about it.

That's because I have yet to come up with a good suggestion on one. I have come up with a few things in these months but they simply aren't good enough. I'll share the list of them and my reasoning behind why they aren't good enough. This may be getting quite off-topic though.

• Guardian angel taking one random item upon activation
  This sink would cause a lot of people to stop buying guardian angel, it would lower the amount of cash sinked as well, not good.
• Exchanging common pvp loot (robin sets, dscims, avas for example) for a currency which you can buy mostly cosmetic upgrades with
  An example would be 5 robin hats for a coloured one, though this wouldn't get too many items sinked since the only benefit to sinking your items there is cosmetics.
• Increasing the alch prices of commonly used pvp items
  Would result in a lot of cash that would need sinking.
• Making max cape (and potentially master capes) take a fire cape, ava and god cape instead of cash
  Got a lot of negative backlash on this one in the master capes suggestion, though I still think this is a good one
• Trading in certain items for double exp time
  Wouldn't appeal to all that many people, would make a some skills a lot more buyable.
• Party room chest taking part of the items put in
  People would avoid party room when doing drop parties

Anyhow, this is getting quite off-topic, so I'll leave this topic alone.

Quote from: Fate on September 24, 2015, 01:48:56 am

@Charr, you've been incessantly preaching about adding item sinks for months, but I have yet to see you make a valid and thorough suggestion as to HOW items should be removed.  It's useless to say we need something but do nothing about it.

That's because I have yet to come up with a good suggestion on one. I have come up with a few things in these months but they simply aren't good enough. I'll share the list of them and my reasoning behind why they aren't good enough. This may be getting quite off-topic though.

• Guardian angel taking one random item upon activation
  This sink would cause a lot of people to stop buying guardian angel, it would lower the amount of cash sinked as well, not good.
• Exchanging common pvp loot (robin sets, dscims, avas for example) for a currency which you can buy mostly cosmetic upgrades with
  An example would be 5 robin hats for a coloured one, though this wouldn't get too many items sinked since the only benefit to sinking your items there is cosmetics.
• Increasing the alch prices of commonly used pvp items
  Would result in a lot of cash that would need sinking.
• Making max cape (and potentially master capes) take a fire cape, ava and god cape instead of cash
  Got a lot of negative backlash on this one in the master capes suggestion, though I still think this is a good one
• Trading in certain items for double exp time
  Wouldn't appeal to all that many people, would make a some skills a lot more buyable.
• Party room chest taking part of the items put in
  People would avoid party room when doing drop parties

Anyhow, this is getting quite off-topic, so I'll leave this topic alone.

'Quite', it's totally off-topic.. I'm gonna have to report this post to a moderator.

Anyhow, you have my full support Otto.

I would like to disable the ability to buy a guardians angel completely, and only have players one when they first start out the game.
This way its a much more reliable way to decide if you have to pay attention to your damage or not, randomly taking an item is very very frustrating and not fun for anyone.

Fixing values of certain items (mostly pvp items) is very needed

Not sure on how to sink popular pvp items (robin, wanna remove it from black demons, add to wildy bosses only) barrow gloves, dragon gloves, gmauls (maybe add degradable), and bows and shit

I would like to disable the ability to buy a guardians angel completely, and only have players one when they first start out the game.
This way its a much more reliable way to decide if you have to pay attention to your damage or not, randomly taking an item is very very frustrating and not fun for anyone.

Fixing values of certain items (mostly pvp items) is very needed

Not sure on how to sink popular pvp items (robin, wanna remove it from black demons, add to wildy bosses only) barrow gloves, dragon gloves, gmauls (maybe add degradable), and bows and shit

Shit is too common. Get 99 slayer -> you have enough of the items you mentioned to be shared equally between half of our whole player base.

Getting hit by constant 40-50's from javelins on a lvl 79 while praying range isn't OP? Not to mention the 60-70's with hunter crossbow through prayer on a lvl 79.. Explain how a melee weapon can compete with constant 30+ from javelins on a level 79 pure.

Level 79 - - - - - > 1 Defence.

Getting hit by constant 40-50's from javelins on a lvl 79 while praying range isn't OP? Not to mention the 60-70's with hunter crossbow through prayer on a lvl 79.. Explain how a melee weapon can compete with constant 30+ from javelins on a level 79 pure.

Said this earlier on this thread:

The problem may lie in how defense is calculated. (defense level) x (defense bonus) = (total defense) is just a dumb way to do it. That means, if one has 99 defense and wears no armor, he has absolutely no defense bonus. Now look at this from pure aspect: having 2 defense levels instead of 1 DOUBLES your total defense. Having defense level of 1 in Emps does jack shit, making people with crap gear hit tons on other pures.

Whip can hit 40+ as well, and we are also going to get the new level 80 whip in the near future. The major difference between whip and the javelins is that whip is only a level 70 weapon, javelins are level 78. The new melee weapon should balance things out a bit.

https://i.gyazo.com/7e9e0435739b8e8069f2f39846263959.png

Level 79 - - - - - > 1 Defence.

http://prntscr.com/8kg2q7

"Whip can hit 40+ as well, and we are also going to get the new level 80 whip in the near future. The major difference between whip and the javelins is that whip is only a level 70 weapon, javelins are level 78. The new melee weapon should balance things out a bit."

How will a level 79 with a whip be able to hit that high consistently? Especially when you're eating the whole time because darts hit 30+ all day. Btw, with range's high hits prayer is not even needed to hit that high/consistent, with melee it is.

+ You're not hitting 40+ without red phat, f cape, and ring of stone, not to mention it still is not consistent enough to compete with range. Go test it for yourself.

Quote from: Bubblebeam2 on September 25, 2015, 01:03:58 am

Level 79 - - - - - > 1 Defence.

http://prntscr.com/8kg2q7

"Whip can hit 40+ as well, and we are also going to get the new level 80 whip in the near future. The major difference between whip and the javelins is that whip is only a level 70 weapon, javelins are level 78. The new melee weapon should balance things out a bit."

How will a level 79 with a whip be able to hit that high consistently? Especially when you're eating the whole time because darts hit 30+ all day. Btw, with range's high hits prayer is not even needed to hit that high/consistent, with melee it is.

+ You're not hitting 40+ without red phat, f cape, and ring of stone, not to mention it still is not consistent enough to compete with range. Go test it for yourself.

You need piety and pot to hit 33 with darts: https://i.gyazo.com/8ce41cb4e5aa59378e971211d73c83c5.png
(I only had fury so I'm just assuming the max hit will be 33 with amulet of ranging)
Without piety, you'll only hit for 28.

''+ You're not hitting 40+ without red phat, f cape, and ring of stone, not to mention it still is not consistent enough to compete with range. Go test it for yourself.''

And that's the point of this thread, an attempt to make ranging items more expensive so both styles would need to risk equal amount of wealth for equal hits. In the previous screenshot I gave you, I didn't have red p hat nor climbing boots and my max hit was 43.

As to have taken hours to read this logical and repeated story, just read Drugs's and Fate's response, those options seem the most logical, since there's too much crap in game.

Make new items (very very very hard to get)

or just delete every ranged item possible and start over.

@Charr, years ago george bought certan items for low price, eventually they vere removed from the game, why not do it again, buy ranged items for a little cash, then remove them all and add a few back and then price it up

actually, if you took the time to pk you'd notice how op range is in fact on both sides maxed and pure. so, being able to hit constant 35+ with d darts which is faster then every other weapon i suppose that's not op to you? then the fact of being able to pull out a c bow even if praying range and having the ability to max out with a 60+ through range isn't op to you? hmmmkk then we got javs that shit in full pure gear not even great gear hit a 60+ hmmmk then we got axes thrown at the speed of rune knifes hit 55+ hmmmk then (we) had the z bow maxing 40+ every hit hmmmkkk and they say there was a change that it got nerfed. gahaha lie detector test determined that's a lie. Still got the same shit happening and you pvmers cant complain its just as easy to get a kill as it was before the update.

Idk.idh.these."connections".of.thought.after.not.playing.for.3.months.even.more.pking.but..Idk.take.it.how.it.is.

Most.of.the.people.complaining.are.pures.

I.used.to.run.around.wild.rekting.pures.with.addy.gloves.glory.ammy.darts.and.ogre.bow.(i.would.even.fight.maxed.60atk.pures.in.maxed.gear..they.would.all.run.because.of.my.risk.and.at.the.same.time.risking.1m.I.could.easily.kill.them)
You.really.dont.need.robin.hats.or.ava.to.hit.good.with.darts.or.comp.bow.

The.only.reason.to.use.them.was.that.they.were.slightly.better.and.ava.costs.like.500k.and.robin.set.like.100k.so.why.not.But.in.reality.using.them.made.little.to.no.change.

even.more.why.use.them.while.no.other.rangepures.were.
There.were.90%.pures.without.robin.or.ava.I.doubt.they.were.all.too.poor.to.afford.600k.set.They.really.didnt.contribute.anything.towards.fighting.vs.melee.pures.
You.could.fuck.them.up.with.darts.ogre.and.javs.while.having.little.to.none.gear.

hcbow.was.automatic.lose.when.dead...I.dont.think.that.it.should.rise.more.in.price.to.shoot.bolts.
Bolts.as.pure.was.for.fun.and.it.was.risky.but.at.the.same.time.pretty.rewarding...tho.darts.and.ogre.bow.would.still.put.up.a.huge.fight.against.cbow.maybe.even.a.better.fight.that.cbow.would.ever.do.so.


again.idkidkidkidk.

but.to.me.it.seems.that.darts.should.hit.fucking.shit.and.be.garbage.when.youre.using.no.gear...same.with.other.ranged.items..but.on.the.same.time.wtf.can.you.really.add.to.pures.to.make.them.hit.more?Gearwise.

thomy.should.probably.nerf.every.ranged.weapon.heavily.when.used.with.no.bonuses...make.robin.and.other.ranged.gear.pretty.rare.and.give.them.good.bonuses.so.you.only.hit.good.with.darts.when.you.use.robin.or.idk.

to.me.it.seems.that.ranged.darts.javs.etc.were.fucking.accurate.on.pures.even.with.not.a.single.item.of.gear.equipt.

so.lets.assume.robin.set.is.like.30m.it.makes.you.hit.good.with.ranged.weapons.as.a.pure.but.without.it.you.hit.garbage.so.you.can.fight.other.people.without.risk.fairly..And.you.couldnt.fight.against.people.who.risk.more.and.actually.hit.better.than.them.

So.kids.with.no.risk.couldnt.fuck.up.pures.with.good.armour.And.at.the.same.time.if.you.use.a.good.ranged.armor.you.can.fight.against.melee.pures.and.you.both.risk.alot.and.have.a.fair.chance.of.winning.the.fight.

but.then.again.theres.gmaul.that.hits.pretty.good.with.no.gear.so.you.would.have.to.change.melee.to.same.logic.so.dds.no.gear.wouldnt.hit.30-30.so.often.only.when.used.with.good.bonuses...that.would.fuck.up.the.game.and.make.it.more.like.that.people.with.wealthy.bank.have.an.edge.in.wild...BUT.THEN.AGAIN.they.wouldnt.have.that.edge.against.people.who.risk.same.and.have.same.bonuses.

BUT.THEN.AGAIN.people.would.quit.pking.cause.atm.wild.is.pretty.fucking.easy.for.pures.to.make.bank.cause.you.can.rekt.people.with.risk.ez.without.risking.over.1m


idk.im.not.gonna.suggest.anything.im.just.gonna.say.1.thing.

pures.are.pussies.you.are.all.punch.of.whining.fucks.who.cant.take.what.you.have.and.turn.it.into.profit.for.yourself.
you.all.expect.a.emps-scape.balance.from.wild.but.you.cant.have.it.because.emps-scape.didnt.fucking.have.javs.claws.oridkfk.

you.cant.have.that.era.back.when.pure.risk.fights.were.against.people.risking.alot.and.k0ing.with.gmaul.

eworld.has.given.you.soooooooofucccccckingmuch.but.you.still.whine.Back.in.scape.we.fought.against.maxed.mains.while.being.gmauler.pures.and.k0ing.them.with.gmauls.NOW.YOU.HAVE.JAVS.CLAWS.AND.THIS.OTHER.SHIT.AND.YOU.CANT.EVEN.KILL.ANOTHER.PURE.
My.first.acc.was.gmauler.I.used.to.fish.like.god.knows.howmany.hours.a.day.to.get.best.set.for.my.pure.then.I.went.to.wild.died.and.repated...I.went.fishing.again...to.get.risk.fights.

---

---

---

Anything.above.this.line.was.a.random.thought.not.my.suggestion..
to.all.pures:
-buy.2.javs.and.comp.bow
-go.to.wild
-wait.till.someone.with.high.risk.comes
-log.in.under.him.from.world2
-jav.him.and.compbow.to.finish
-I.guarantee.he.cant.even.react
-loot.maxed.pure.set
-ez50m
-go.to.duel.area.stake.your.50m.and.lose.it
-come.to.forums.to.cry.how.uneven.purepking.is

Loljk.I.can.tell.thats.what.most.of.you.did.
Fuckingpkers.only.whine.while.having.0.ideas.how.to.fix.your.own.wild.that.you.so.much.love.
dont.see.any.pkers.in.feedback.thread.giving.feedback.and.ideas.only.fucking.whining.on.shoutbox.

the.only.2.things.that.I.can.see.100%.are

1)javs.ogre.dbow.darts.bolts...were.all.fucking.op.on.pures.while.not.having.any.gear.
2)I.honestly.wouldnt.really.change.anything.heavily...But.if.you.want.to.make.avas.and.robinsets.more.expensive.you.have.to.remember.that.darts.and.all.the.other.ranged.weapons.work.fucking.well.without.them.So.people.wont.jump.right.into.investing.into.them.cause.they.are.useless.But.if.you.randomly.give.them.even.bigger.bonuses.like.I.previously.said.ranged.will.get.more.op.
3)pures.are.dipshits.most.of.them.literally.have.1.account.and.its.their.pure.they.know.nothing.about.the.game.but.whine.the.most.Our.combat.and.pk.system.could.be.worse...you.can.pk.shittons.a.day.being.a.pure.when.theres.people.to.fight.in.wilderness..you.can.make.alot.of.bank.doing.it.I.doubt.people.dont.pk.because.combat.system.sucks.its.our.playercount.that.sucks...And.our.playercount.doesnt.suck.because.of.our.combatsystem...

also.this.topic.goes.over.my.head.while.trying.to.answer.it.from.a.purepker.viewpoint.while.not.pking.anymore.You.shouldnt.take.it.seriously.but.maybe.its.time.to.wake.up.pures.and.try.find.solutions.to.your.own.game.because.you.are.the.players.that.need.it.the.most.and.see.its.effects.every.fucking.day

all i have tried to do is make changes. iv given feedback iv done everything i could but it gets bashed and then this dude saying range isn't op is the funniest shit iv read today. but sadly nothen will happen abut it and btw g maul was nerfed without gear you cant even max a 32 lol mater fact with great gear you'd be lucky to hit a 32 and the fact that range pkers didn't even have to gear up and risk to hit there max is the saddest thing if any of these people took the time to notice the wildy you'd see only range pkers.

well.thats.what.I.said.range.doesnt.even.require.a.gear.to.hit.good.
and.gmaul.nerf.was.suggested.by.me.but.I.said.it.was.op.on.mains(and.it.was)It.should.not.have.been.so.stronk.for.mains.for.a.400k.weapon.

When.it.changed.for.pures.also.I.was.disappointed.a.bit.myself.because.I.tried.to.avoid.it.(I.was.trying.to.atleast.suggest.that.they.keep.it.untouched.on.pures.if.somehow.possible)
But.that.wasnt.possible.

I.dont.think.that.gmaul.is.bad.for.pures.its.just.that.range.is.too.good?

about.gmaul...again...the.change.on.mains.came.out.imo.perfect.no.idea.about.pures.maybe.you.should.boost.it.again.abit?(not.back.to.original.prenerf.but.abit)

anyways.just.assuming.here.again.cause.I.dont.purepk.

gmauls.should.also.be.more.expensive.when.boosted.maybe.around.1m/ish?