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Offline Charr

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Improving the current minigames
« on: April 24, 2016, 01:55:17 pm »
I've been over this subject a few times and it has gotten results, so I'm gonna talk about it again. The main purpose of this topic is to point out some things that are kind of holding the minigames back and provide a possible solution.

Castle wars

The main complaint about this minigame is afkers, people see them as deadweight to the team and get pretty upset about them. First off I'll adress why there are so many afkers: simply being inside the minigame is more significant as far as rewards go than actually contributing to the victory condition. The amount of value people get in extra tickets does not make up for the effort that they have to put in, at least, that's likely what people that afk inside the minigame are thinking.

A possible solution to this is shifting the majority of tickets towards contribution, rather than participating. Currently you get 5 tickets for being in the losing team at the end of the game. This is the same amount of tickets you would get extra for taking 5 flags to your base by yourself or for killing 25 players. The numbers make participating feel kind of insignificant. This should be changed, as it devalues contributing to the victory condition of the minigame.

First off, the participation rewards should take a huge hit. Losing should go from 5 to 2 tickets, winning should go from 10 to 5 tickets. This absolutely destroys any reason anyone would afk in the minigame.

Contributing should directly give you more tickets. The amount of extra tickets you get for a flag should go from 1 to 5. For every flag captured the entire team should also recieve 1 extra ticket, this would not count for the person that gets the flag. Contributing to killing someone holding a flag will give you 1 ticket, getting the kill (doing the most damage) will give you 2. The people you have to kill for an extra ticket should be lowered from 5 to 3.

Lower levels may suffer from this, so they should recieve some compensation as well. The npcs around the castle could be used for this. Currently I find that immediately putting 10 range/mage npcs on the wall right at the start of the game is a bit too much. Especially considering they hit pretty high and pretty often, even if you wear defensive armour. The npcs also feel a lot stronger than they should be, they are quite difficult to kill, their hp should be lowered. The game should start off with no npcs present.

Some player effort should be put in to summon them. This can be done by charging an orb located on the same floor as your respawn room. Charging it will lower your defence and drain your prayer. Charging it for a certain amount of time will summon an npc, and the players charging it will recieve an extra ticket. Npc spawning will be faster if less npcs are present and if more players are charging. If all npcs are present they will be healed and get a boost to their accuracy up to a cap. Npcs should recieve bonus damage/accuracy to flag carriers as well, giving people a valid reason to start using the underground passage. Killing 5 npcs also results in an extra ticket, killed npcs will only respawn if the orb is charged.

Rewards shop does kind of need improvement, aside from brawlers, but I haven't come up with anything for that yet.

Pest control

Farming, farming, farming, it's what pest control has been all about. People downright flame eachother over killing spinners and not defending, pest control generally doesn't feel like too much fun to me because of that. From a design perspective it's also not a very good thing for the victory condition (killing all the portals) to not be lined up with the best way to earn tickets. The minigame isn't played the way it should be. The update that made it so that all the portals had to be killed for this brought great improvement to this, however it did not kill off farming entirely.

The major factor in recieving tickets should be killing the portals, not dealing damage. A time dependant multiplier should be added, this serverely increase the amount of tickets you get for finishing early. There should be a base amount of tickets earned when doing a set amount of damage to portals as well.

The rewards have taken a big hit since void was made tradable and elite void was made better than normal void. People no longer need to play pest control to obtain void. The sudden supply of void sets when it was made tradable pretty much obliterated any kind of demand there was for the set. This was impacted even worse when elite sets were made better than normal ones, as the normal top & bottoms are now kind of useless. The only things that are kind of worth getting from pest now are ring of vigour and the exp rewards. Don't get me wrong, making void tradable was definitely a good choice.

To solve the problem of normal sets being useless I propose we do the following: Any elite sets lost on death will turn into normal sets. Normal sets are upgradable with pest control tokens. Elite sets will also become untradable. This will at least put the normal top/bottom into a cycle of being upgraded, degraded and traded and thus create demand for them.

The fact that the sets aren't sinked is quite a problem though. I don't have any good solution for that currently. What we could do is make them disappear on death in pvp, but that would kind of bring us back to people not risking anything when using void.

I want to bring up defenders here as well. They are in a similar situation as void but are in a worse state. I feel it wouldn't be a bad idea if we had them disappear completely or turn into a low amount of cash (something like 50k) up until 20 wilderness. In fact that may be a decent solution for a lot of items commonly used in pvp that are oversupplied.


Feedback is appreciated.
;

Offline Someone12116

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Re: Improving the current minigames
« Reply #1 on: April 24, 2016, 03:26:42 pm »
When will people learn that the AFKers are currently essential to Castle Wars. Because the rewards are utter garbage, there simply isn't enough ''legit'' players to keep the games going. That's why people who play CW as supposed to also need to AFK it with multiple accounts at the same time. People don't AFK CW to gain money, because there will simply not be enough people to buy the 100 Avas that you're able to get during a weekend when AFKing with ~10 accounts. Brawling gloves are untradeable so no matter on how many accounts you AFK on, the rate at which your main account gains pairs of gloves cannot be increased.

In addition to garbage rewards, running flags is so much more boring as opposed to what Castle Wars was back in Scape. It takes one person to run the flag and a couple people to support him. I often feel completely useless when playing CW, because of the fact that I hate running flags. Back in scape, you needed your whole damn team to kill the boss faster than the enemy team. CW with bosses was more fast pace because of shorter games and more action. If you aren't a die hard fan of CW, the chances are you'll get bored after a single game of actually playing it.
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Offline Beershake

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Re: Improving the current minigames
« Reply #2 on: April 24, 2016, 04:00:54 pm »
I feel that these are needed, but it may be risky because people might just stop playing those minigames
Emps-Scape player since 2010!
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Offline Triangle Dot

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Re: Improving the current minigames
« Reply #3 on: April 24, 2016, 06:44:43 pm »
What about Barrows? It is minigame after.

Offline Ashootsh

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Re: Improving the current minigames
« Reply #4 on: April 24, 2016, 06:59:15 pm »
When will people learn that the AFKers are currently essential to Castle Wars. Because the rewards are utter garbage, there simply isn't enough ''legit'' players to keep the games going. That's why people who play CW as supposed to also need to AFK it with multiple accounts at the same time. People don't AFK CW to gain money, because there will simply not be enough people to buy the 100 Avas that you're able to get during a weekend when AFKing with ~10 accounts. Brawling gloves are untradeable so no matter on how many accounts you AFK on, the rate at which your main account gains pairs of gloves cannot be increased.

In addition to garbage rewards, running flags is so much more boring as opposed to what Castle Wars was back in Scape. It takes one person to run the flag and a couple people to support him. I often feel completely useless when playing CW, because of the fact that I hate running flags. Back in scape, you needed your whole damn team to kill the boss faster than the enemy team. CW with bosses was more fast pace because of shorter games and more action. If you aren't a die hard fan of CW, the chances are you'll get bored after a single game of actually playing it.
Exactly old CWS were more better than now.


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Offline Charr

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Re: Improving the current minigames
« Reply #5 on: April 24, 2016, 07:04:51 pm »
What about Barrows? It is minigame after.
It does not need improvement imo.
;

Offline Try Again Fo

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Re: Improving the current minigames
« Reply #6 on: April 24, 2016, 08:39:17 pm »
The main complaint about this minigame is afkers, people see them as deadweight to the team and get pretty upset about them.
For some of them it's incredibly huge deadweight, agree with that.
But not for me i guess. When i need tickets badly i'm thankful from the bottom of my heart that there is atleast someone afking so i can start the god damn game.
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Offline Eddie1408

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Re: Improving the current minigames
« Reply #7 on: April 24, 2016, 09:59:21 pm »
Both mini games are poorly designed and got even worse after the rewards were made tradable. There is no grinding. There is no challenge. There is only garbage. These will be my suggestion how to improve these two mini games and maybe  make them attractive again.


Castle-Wars:

- new win condition: stealing 10 flags. (20 minutes to complete the goal, ends in a draw when the time is up).

- new reward for the winner team: doubles all tickets gained.

- holding a flag will make you bleed (1-2 damage every second; depending on combat lvl)

- holding a flag increases your defensive bonuses by 1.5 (not sure about this idea)

- new ways of earning tickets (every player will earn tickets by himself for doing following things):
succesfully stealing a flag (3-5 points)
killing a flag holder (1 point)
each 100-300 damage done ((players only, also depending on combat level) 1 point)
setting up 10-15 barricades (1 point)

- shop prices need to be changed according to the new ticket gaining.

- no time for afker/leechers: afking without doing anykind of damage or taking flags results in 0 points. Even if your team wins you get nothing.

- new rewards: too lazy to suggest now





Pest-Control:

- npcs will no longer target void knight (WTF, right?)

- void knight loses 1 health everytime a player dies (void knight's health increases with more players).

- npc rework:
shifter: new spawn location (portal) and they ignore prayers.
spinner: they will never lose focus -> heal portal till the end (even if you attack them)
splatter: they will follow you (no attack move) and lose 1 health every second until they die (they only deal damage to players)
torcher: can additionally freeze you (10% chance) for 3 seconds
ravager: no changes.
defiler: high accurate,(very) low damage, fast hitting
brawler: less damage

- only one portal will be vulnerable at a time. Once the portal gets destroyed, a new one will lose its shield.

- everytime a portal gets destroyed, all npcs get stronger:
shifter: more damage and higher accuracy
spinner:  more health and more healing
splatter: lose health even faster and deal more damage
torcher: can additionally freeze you for 6/9/12 seconds for every destroyed portal
ravager: no changes.
defiler: more accuracy
brawler: more hp

- everytime a portal gets destroyed, npcs spawn faster.

- 1 token upon losing.

- 10 tokens upon winning (top 5 players with the most damage dealt get 1-5 additional tokens):
damage done to npcs: x1
damage done to portal: x5

- minimum requirement to receive tokens: 300 damage (GGWP leechers)

- skillers can earn tokens by repairing gates and barricades (25 'damage' each)

- shop prices need to be changed according to the new token gains.

- shop rework: too lazy to suggest now






What was I thinking?

Castle-Wars is insanely boring. When both teams just afk-steal flags for 20 minutes and every1 gets 10-15 points, you know something went wrong.
With these suggestions, you really want to win because of the juicy reward (double tickets).
Additionally it is not all about the flags anymore, but also about how much damage you deal to your enemies (fighting is rewarding *kreygasm*). Of course stealing flags should give the most tickets because the main goal is to steal the flags.

I think Pest-Control is a total desaster (same as castle-wars :doge:). In a 'pvm minigame' where people fight more against themselves (attacker vs defender and flaming towards people who do not want to farm) than against the actual game is more than just retarded.
With my suggestions, I wanted to make sure that all players unite and try to win by doing the same thing: Dealing most damage (skillers got no rights). Making the npcs stronger and more annoying everytime a portal gets destroyed brings the game to the next level.


With this suggestions both mini-games will be unique (emps-world is known as having unique content) and leechers/afker have no chance to earn anything.
The rewards are also a big deal, but I honestly do not know what to add there since too much damage was already done (tradable void, etc.)




« Last Edit: April 25, 2016, 09:51:17 am by Eddie1408 »
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